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Karazhan, now with more suck

What I want:
Lilac, the munchkin of mad DPS, to get the spiffy necklace out of Kara and knock down HKM and Gruul.
Tatia, heally goat goddess of the neverending mana pool, to get ZA upgrades.. to see SSC.

What I actually get:
Lilac, the munchkin of meh DPS, helps WK to painful limp through Curator and Illhoof. It was a painful to the extreme Kara run. Frustrating just.. UGH. Nights like that make me want to play alts.. or go watch TV.

The night started.. as most Monday nights do.. with us trying to assess who was logged on to goto Kara. We’re supposed to start at 7:30. It’s supposed to be our best-of-the-best toons.. with 1-2 toons who need gear. At 7:20 I ran Tatia (holy paladin) down to the door.. and then logged onto Lilac (affliction warlock).

I really want Lilac to go into Kara. She needs the gear and Tatia doesn’t.. and I want to play her more. A quick count of logged in accounts showed that we only had one healer on.. and even that one was someone’s alt. I briefly whined at fiancee. I knew how this was going to go.. we were going to get to 7:30.. there weren’t going to be any other healers.. and I’d be asked (for the team) to log onto Tatia. He said “Just don’t do it. Just say ‘NO’ “. But no I can’t do that.. because then I’m a bitch for preventing the guild from going into Kara.

So instead we started making calls. Zynnia didn’t answer her phone.. Khoss eventually answered and said he thought the raid started at 8:30. *sigh* He did log in though.. so with two healers I could kind of justify playing Lilac. Kinda.. we would have been more comfortable with three healers.. but all of WK’s other healers are MIA.

The group was: Gongniu (Warrior Tank), Heimdal (Paladin offTank), Khoss (Resto Shaman), Seanarra (Holy Paladin), Lilac (ME)(Affliction Warlock), Gaelentu (Destruction Warlock), Erassmus (Fire Mage), Raouen (MM Hunter), Krullwyn (BM Hunter), Floki (Rogue).

Seanarra started off the night by apologizing if he slurred his words.. but his arm was forcing him to drink beer. Loverly.. nothing really beats drunk healing *sigh*.

We walked in the back portal and grouped up in the breezeway for buffs/food/cookies. Erassmus opened the door and ran forward to lay his table down inside. We warned him against that in the future because the mobs are really close to the door. Just as he pulled the mob the tank moved forward to intercept it (yeah) and then (almost unnoticed) Erassmus shot off up the ramp.. and pulled the mob at the top of that ramp.

I saw him.. I called it out and suggested he bring that mob down to the group.. and not wander off from the group. He seemed to become offended.. and said his keyboard was sticky (ick) and his autorun had gotten stuck and had run him into those mobs.

Inauspicious start.

We made one attempt on Nightbane. After explaining the fight and positioning we pulled. At the first Charred Earth both Erassmus and Gaelentu died. It turns out Gaelen had disconnected.. but still.. continuing with our inauspicious night. The group decided our DPS was low.. so instead of trying Nightbane again we moved up to Curator.

More pain. Suffering. Unhappiness. We eventually got Curator down on the third or forth attempt. *sigh* Two hours had passed at this point. This is -supposed- to be our zerg night. We’re supposed to know what we’re doing and do it well. Instead it was the major suck.

We moved up to Illhoof. The last time we did this Lilac seeded everything that moved, Khoss healed Lilac. Everyone else killed Illhoof/chains it was beautiful and easy. Not so much this time. EVERY SINGLE person who got chained died for our first two attempts. On our third attempt someone lived through the chains.. but almost immediately the tank died. *sigh*. Sensing a trend.. (and the end of the night approaching) I offered to log on Tatia to help with healing. We did the switch (and then spent ~30 mins summoning people back who’d needed to repair) and then we were -finally- able to get Illhoof down.

What was wrong?
– Not one of the DPS in this run were our high DPS A-game toons. So instead of being a zerg team.. we were a “meh” team. This definitely showed in our performance.
– With low DPS we should have made up for it with more healers.. having only two healers put us at a disadvantage.
– Lilac’s DPS is lacking. I do know that I was very tentative in the Nightbane fight.. I was afraid that if I freely dotted him that he’d aggro on me during the flight part of the fight. At Curator I had no problems targeting the Astral Flares.. but hitting them with Searing Pain seems almost pointless. I’m not spec’d for fire damage.. so hitting them for 600 points a pop just seems pitiful. Illhoof.. I have no problems with my DPS on Illhoof. Spamming seed is tons of fun.. but it’s true that Gaelentu, with his deep destruction spec is better suited to that job by just doing hellfire repeatedly. I think mainly we lacked healing on that fight.. which is why switching out Lilac for Tatia made it possible for us to win.
– Gaelentu’s DPS was -way- lacking.
** On inspection, Gaelentu has crap-for-gear. No, I take that back.. he has very obviously “I just dinged 70 and don’t group much” gear. I chatted with him after the run. He’s an engineer/miner so can’t get FSW. I’ve spoken with a couple of guildies and fiancee and I think I’ll see if I can craft him some more useful gear.
**He can hear us on Vent but can’t talk back. This has lead to a lot of frustration in the raid since he doesn’t seem to “get” things as quickly as we’d like. It also means that to us he has no personality. We don’t know him.. and without being able to talk with him we can’t get to know him. Add to that,
** he has connection problems.. so sometimes when we’re telling him to do something.. and he’s not doing it.. it’s not because he doesn’t understand.. instead it’s because he’s lagging or disconnecting. I hope he’ll be able to get that fixed.
** He has solo’d demonology all the way to 70.. I don’t know that he’s ever run an instance. This leaves him lacking a lot of basic grouping skills. The things you come to expect.. and forget that not everyone just knows them off the mark. Despite this he seems to have a fair amount of initiative and seems willing to keep coming back even with the horrible abuses.
– Erasmmus’ DPS was lacking. I don’t think he has crappy gear.. but 655 +spell seems low for a mage in mostly Kara gear. Given that he’s in mostly Kara gear I expected him to have higher DPS. Dunno on this one.

WWS: http://wowwebstats.com/y5orr4vgdbft5

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10 comments to Karazhan, now with more suck

  • Gimia

    Yes I do believe that having 655 spell damage is very low for a mage in mostly Kara gear. My holy priest has about that much in his crappy mix of 2 things of Kara spell damage gear and the rest his healing gear.

    With Gaelentu, he can still have a personality if he lets himself open up and at least respond with chat and be social outside of raids. I myself am the “don’t have a mic” type because of not really wanting to use it but still get myself out there with the rest of everybody by making sure to ask questions and most of all have fun with raiding!

  • That next to last point hits home for me. I solo’d my way up to 70 with both my main and my senior alt (a lock), and learning the dynamics of a group has been challenging. Thankfully my guild didn’t take it as a personal shortcoming and was patient in explaining the ins and outs of being a Huntard in a group (i.e., turn off pet taunt, how to use MD, that sort of thing).

    I’m still sussing my lock’s place in the group.

  • Ice

    Hi there.
    I am reading your blog regularly, cause I have a twink-lock myself and therefore found your blog. My main is an hunter which I play for more than 3 years now. Excuse my english, its not my first language (german is)

    You are right, your whole dps-department sucked at that evening…especially your hunters. I experienced those horrible Kara nights myself so I feel with you ^^

    I looked through your WWS report and wanted to give some advices to Krullwyn.

    Your MM shouldnt outdps your BM. What I can see form your WWS your MM did a solid job if he is mostly blue with some Kara epics.

    Your BM hunter seems to try to get into a 3:2 rotation (cause more steady shots than autoshots) but with a horrible dps output. He uses is Pet not enough. Pet DPS should be about al least 25-30% from his DPS an he should try just one speacial shot (steady, arcane or multishot) between his autoshots and try to avoid clipping his steadys into his autos. With that and if he is 50:50 blue/epic his DPS should see a sighnificant boost.

    If he is willing to learn more about BM Hunters just tell him about bigredkitty.net

    Greetings from germany
    Ice

  • Nibuca

    Thank you for your suggestions. I’ll pass them on to Krullwyn.

  • Leo Diogenes

    Nibuca,

    - sigh -

    I am sorry to cause everyone such grief. Erasmus and Gaelen are good friends of mine. But, in many ways they are stuck and I dont know how to unstick them.

    Erasmus still has the mindset of the pre-BC days. He is a fire mage and convinced that they are the “Gods” of mages. He is constantly comparing himself to my own mage Daegothh(sadly he does not even come close). I honestly think his +spell hit is in the teens somewhere. But, he won’t be convinced that he needs it much higher. He’s stuck in a cycle of pyroblast, fireball, fireball, pull aggro, die. Honestly, I’m kinda at my wits end with him and I wish he’d move on to another character.

    You are right about Gaelen, he has no instance or raid experience. Group dynamic is virtually unknown to him. He grew up on a PVP server and transfered at lvl 65 or so. All he knows of the game is solo work and getting ganked. It took me forver to convince him that the blueberry is his worst demon pet. Anyway, he seems to listen and is very interested in adapting to the guild. There is hope for him. I am very grateful to you Nibuca for taking the time to tutor him.

    Oh, and his mic thing should be fixed soon. From what I understand he had driver problems.

    As for myself… If you dont want to heal again I am fine with it, and I will back you up. However, its kinda hard to live in your shadow, you are a great healer and pally healing is such that you can really focus on your target and keep them alive. With my shaman I know I can blanket heal everyone but I feel pressed when I have to concentrate on one person. I honestly dont know why this is with buffed healing of almost +2000.

    Leo

  • Nibuca

    It’s not that I don’t ever want to heal again.. but when I look at a run and Tatia can get nothing from the run except for a repair bill.. and Lilac can potentially get 4 pieces of gear and badges she needs to buy 4 more pieces of gear.. it’s really hard to get excited to be the healer.

    Pally healing is what it is. I think that in 5-mans and Heroics I actually have it a little bit easier than Shaman healers. I have to decide who doesn’t live because I can’t heal everyone.. you on the other hand have to try and heal everyone and hope the healing is enough to cover the tank. I dread AOE situations because there’s a good chance I won’t be able to get a heal off on everyone before I have to go back to the Tank. I think you’re doing a fantastic job and aren’t giving yourself enough credit.

    It’s joked that pally healing is two button healing.. and to some extent that’s true. There’s not a lot of variety. The biggest choice for a fight is “which aura should I run?” other than that it’s flash, flash, flash, Holy Light, flash, cleanse, flash. Every fight looks the same. Hell, my targets don’t even change.

    With Lilac there’s a lot more variety. I’m having to think about it and make choices depending on the circumstances. Which curse? which dot? should I dot everything? Do I have enough time for a dot before the mob dies? It’s just more dynamic. And yes.. that’s making it more fun.

    I agree with you that I’m unsure what to do about Erasmmus. He doesn’t seem willing to change and doesn’t seem willing to take any suggestions. Gaelen looks a little easier to work with. In all I don’t think they’re bad additions.. but really we have to get to know them before we can easily work with them.

    It’s like knowing that you tip-toe around gear discussions with you and your wife….. or always look in guild roster to find out Grimr’s toon’s professions (before asking), or never ask Edith to mark when she’s tanking.. it’s all peculiar to the individual.. and we don’t know them yet.. so don’t know the hot buttons. Hopefully we’ll play with them enough to find (and thus avoid) the hot buttons.

  • Hmm. As a whole seems to remind me of my last month several weeks back raiding Kara. The groups weren’t the same, DPS was low, people were on their alts and nothing was well with the world. We had people having constant DC and lag as some were in Asian time zones. Thats when i eventually got frustrated with the guild back then. Rest is written history as you know.

    Don’t burn yourself out. Im sure i got that advice from you too but you should be able to raid on your Warlock with other people picking up the slack being accountable to show up for the raids and as healers. I knew we had same problems with my last guilds as well with healers or them not showing up.

  • Sorry you had a rough time with Kara. When raids filled with a good bunch of people sorta dont click for a night, its pretty brutal. Happens to every guild, hopefully you’ll bounce back and next week we’ll see a post titled “Kara, now with more glee :-)

    Browsing the WWS report, I do see some things that your Hunters can do to help DPS a little bit. Taking the Curator kill fight for example….

    Hunter Kill Command not being used. Krullwyn had 37 crits and only fired off KC 9 times. Raouen had 49 crits and used Kill Command zero (0) times. This is a very big amount of damage just left sitting there on the table. Because of the way the cooldown works, its not usually a 1 to 1 match of KC for each crit, especially when things like Drums of Battle are in use, but it should be pretty close and definitely more than zero. Perhaps ask the hunters to install Critical Alert addon which will notify them of crits so they can more easily know when to trigger Kill Command.

    Additionally, Raouen’s pet did not use any special attacks such as claw, bite, or gore during the fight. Even though he does not appear to be a Beast Master spec, his pet can still be contributing much more damage to the raid by training in and activating an appropriate special attack.

    And one more for the record…the fight lasted over 7 minutes. Krullwyn only used Bestial Wrath twice during the fight. On a 2 minute cooldown, I’d expect to see 4 BW’s during the fight (one at the opening, at the 2 minute mark, 4 minute mark, and 6 minute mark). You invested many talent points to achieve that 41-point ability, so you owe it to your raid to use it. This is some big damage left sitting there for the taking.

    Amavas last blog post..Including Your Special Someone

  • I wouldn’t worry too much about dotting NIghtbane before he flies. I didn’t even consider that an issue and was actually refreshing DOTs on him once he had taken off. Even slammed a Curse of Doom on him! Didn’t get aggro once.

    Also, on Illhoof, I seed him not the imps and rotate in some Dark Pacts and Life Taps. That way there is no frantic re-targetting you can just sit there spamming 2 or 3 buttons and a quick SB or two on the chains when they come.

    I can totally empathise with you about taking Taita into Kara, I totally hate taking HolyWarrior in. It seems so totally pointless when all his gear upgrade come from SSC/TK/MH and BT. The only thing he really needs from there is a tanking shield and maybe Moroes Pocket Watch!

    HolyWarriors last blog post..Epix for EvilBastard

  • Nibuca

    @Amava: I called and chatted with Krullwyn. I’ll pass your comments on to Raouen the next time I see her. Now if only an uber warlock could come on and look at Lilac’s performance and help me put a finger on my problems with her DPS.

    @HolyWarrior: Yeah, next time “damn the torpedos, full-speed ahead”. Though I’m still hesitant about CoD. The Nightbane fight is one where it’s better to do gimpy DPS than to pull aggro. Having CoD go off at the wrong time is just -asking- for a raid wipe. (much like the raid-wipe caused by Lilac by CoDing Netherspite at the wrong time).

    On the Illhoof fight, I -like- seeding everything.. I think it causes a-lot- more damage than I’d get from just seeding Illhoof. That said, having a destruction spec’d warlock use hellfire between the gates seemed very easy.